Wal-Mart resists plan for altering intersection
By MICHAEL ANICH, The Leader-HeraldJOHNSTOWN - Wal-Mart officials have agreed to most of Fulton County's requests in the state environmental quality review process involving the retailer's Supercenter project in Gloversville.
County Planning Director James Mraz told the Board of Supervisors' Buildings and Grounds-Highway Committee on Monday the only measure not accepted to date is the proposed reconstruction of the intersection of Harrison Street and County Highway 128 (South Kingsboro Avenue Extension). He said Wal-Mart officials contend that is not needed.
The company accepted measures such as the county's abandonment of 500 feet of County Highway 128.
County officials are concerned about the Supercenter's possible effect on County Highway 128. The Board of Supervisors passed a resolution last July recommending mitigative measures to the Gloversville Planning Board.
Mraz said most measures were agreed to by Wal-Mart, with the exception of what to do about the Harrison Street-County Highway 128 intersection. He said that issue is "up in the air."
He said county officials noted a year ago the intersection is not at a "perfect T" right angle. Mraz reminded the committee it was concerned about the volume of traffic at the intersection and asked that it be reconstructed.
"Wal-Mart has come back and said they don't think we need to do that," Mraz said.
He said Wal-Mart officials feel it's "not an issue" because truck traffic will be more inclined to use a proposed roundabout closer to the store.
Wal-Mart anticipates about 90 trucks going to the Supercenter site each week, Mraz said, and the retailer suggests a flashing yellow "intersection ahead" sign on Harrison Street near Route 29 to make vehicles aware of the Harrison Street-County Highway 128 intersection.
Mraz said Wal-Mart also is proposing a traffic study or evaluation of the intersection, perhaps six to 12 months after the opening of the store. It also was proposed that any restaurants, stores or other businesses adjacent to the store could share in the cost of any future traffic study.
The Supercenter project, which Mraz said has been a "challenge," was first announced in 2004 by then-Gloversville Mayor Frank La Porta.
"This project is moving toward completion of a SEQR process," Mraz said.
It took until January 2007 for Wal-Mart to unveil its plans for the 186,979-square-foot Supercenter. The project would involve the creation of 890 parking spaces, extension of municipal water and sewer services, construction of storm-water infrastructure and a wetlands mitigation area.
The Wal-Mart store on Fifth Avenue Extension in the town of Johnstown would close when the new store opens. The Supercenter would employ about 200 people, almost twice the number at the Johnstown store.
Michael Anich can be reached by e-mail at johnstown@leaderherald.com
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TiredOfTax
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07-05-09 11:16 AM
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The board has been standing their ground, and standing and now it is time to move, the grass is growing through their shoes. The time has past to get this thing moving, 5 years is not haste it is (becoming) waste. There are alterative routes in this area to go where you want without even going within sight of the store. Maybe you will need a guide or a map to get through our vast region, but in time you will find a route that works for you and it will become familiar to you and it will be OK. Maybe we can help those "mail carriers" find a safe route as well! It is time to find your place in the NEW good days.
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thegoodoldays
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07-05-09 10:27 AM
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ToT,too much speculation by people who don't even live in the area! First, "Wal-Mart officials contend that is not needed" (reconstruction of intersection). Are these the same officials that came from Arkansas? Second,"It also was proposed that any restaurants,stores or other businesses adjacent to the store COULD share in the cost of any future traffic study"(after the store has been open for 6-12 months)And what guarantee is there that they will contribute? Not only will the traffic increase even more, but by then it will be too late. At least we agree that this area is in dire need of the tax revenue but to jump on the bandwagon without considering every alternative for the safety of those who drive around here just isn't right in my opinion. Also, a traffic circle IS NOT the answer. With school buses,cars,tractor trailers(90/week) and mail carriers involved we'd better it get it right the first time. Stand your ground Planning Board!
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TiredOfTax
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07-04-09 5:01 PM
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resident69, any sales tax from a new Wal-Mart is an increase to Gloversville as we get zero from them now. A decrease form something is still better than zero. I suggest we take the something.
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resident69
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07-04-09 4:32 PM
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The current plaza where Wally world sits IS NOT in Gloversville. It's up to the slumlord to find new tenants. Remember how long it sat empty when Nichols and Grand Union closed up. Thank god Target opened so I have a place to shop. I'll still shop Price Chopper for food and not the super duper wally world.
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resident69
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07-04-09 4:28 PM
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I have to laugh that people believe Gloversville is going to get a boost in the sales tax. The last report out was the Town of Johnstown was DOWN! Hmmm Wally World sits in the Town of Johnstown currently! So they are not even helping The Town but it will boost Gloversville! Keep Dreaming! Wally world is now trying to focus on the upper class taxpayers and so all the welfare citizens will not have a place to shop. Look at Amsterdam and see what is missing!
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TiredOfTax
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07-04-09 10:52 AM
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Did you read the last two paragraphs of this article? Just the construction jobs and the employment projections warrant our support. And like Wal-Mart said: "It also was proposed that any restaurants, stores or other businesses adjacent to the store could share in the cost of any future traffic study."
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TiredOfTax
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07-04-09 10:39 AM
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Gooddays Wal-Marts resisting building here has nothing at all to do with the traffic, it has to do with not being required to build a massive road and signaling system in hopes that someone else may join in the fray and try to run a business here. It has presented a solution that fits the need and that is not good enough for some. If a more intricate intersection is warranted then use to TAX revenue from the Super Wal-Marts existence to fix it. But likely our leaders have plans for those hard fought over tax dollars that does not include roads. Or we simply continue to balk at expansion until the retirement community, or NYS parks takes us over. Maybe forever wild is the future of Fulton county!
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thegoodoldays
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07-04-09 8:35 AM
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The vast majority of these posts do not even address the reason that Walmart "resists" moving forward.Traffic IS already a problem at both ends of Hales Mills Rd so lets add a Walmart without figuring this out. The smell of money comes before the safety of everyone who travels in that area(school buses,tractor trailers,commuters to name a few). Talk about short-sighted....
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TiredOfTax
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07-03-09 11:53 PM
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Well when you add layer after layer of opposition to them yeah I guess they would start to rethink all of their position thus slowing down the process. If we accommodated them from the start I would bet there would be a huge new super Wal-Mart already in business. I am so sorry that you are tired of my non-sense there mountainman, maybe if you tell me the non part of the sense I could help you understand. And as far as the tax rate in Montgomery county, if it is like you say "property taxes vs. property value the highest in the state" where exactly would they be without this added tax income?
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Hilltopper
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07-03-09 5:27 PM
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If Montgomery Co. has it "figured out", why are property taxes vs. property value the highest in the state ?
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MountainMan
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07-03-09 1:52 PM
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Hey Tired, I'm really getting "tired" of your nonsense. If you bothered to investigate, you would discover that Wal-Mart has been delaying their responses to the Planning Board by months.
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westielover
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07-03-09 11:02 AM
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Has anyone been in downtown Gloversville lately? The weekend of the art festival, with farmers market and a few businesses with open house events found all sorts of people wanting their city to flourish again. People here want a city again and there are those that are working to make it happen. Kudos to them.
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TiredOfTax
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07-03-09 10:42 AM
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and arch can you even see this site from your lakeVIEW property?
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TiredOfTax
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07-03-09 10:41 AM
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This crap should have been settled a year or more ago. It is the feet dragging hand holding stuff that is going to end this and future opportunities. Other new business chances will vanish as well. Do you want to sit here mumbling about it, or prosper? Something positive is way better than sitting on your hands waiting for the next golden egg. Get it over, get it built! Get the TAXES!
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TheArchitect
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07-03-09 10:09 AM
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If Wal-Mart really wants a new Supercenter in the City of Gloversville, then they MUST develop a store consistent with the needs of the community so that more development could occur as a result of this store. However, as proposed, this Supercenter will create a traffic gridlock that will decrease the opportunity for commercial and retail expansion. Our leaders must get back to the table and give Wal-Mart an ultimatum. Do it the right way, or don't do it at all. The proposed location might not be the best location for Fulton County either. There are certainly much better site that don't have the numerous environmental impacts that the proposed site has.
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TiredOfTax
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07-03-09 9:47 AM
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You know Wal-Mart has no tolerance for crap, when a town rejects them they do leave. When the ma and pa stores are crushed into the ground and the towns people stand over their dead dreams pouting that more should have been done to save them from their Wal-Mart demise. All I can say is Wal-Mart survives for the same reason the small stores are dying, greed. If people did not care about price then all would be great at the local level, just pay what they want and go home. But today the economy is not good and if we follow our leaders in the spend not save mode what we will have is a LOT of open space for businesses to fail in. I know that the local venders have a long history here and have given much to the community in taxes and services but lets turn the page, lets grow not get rolled over again by the competition from other towns!
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ADKMike
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07-03-09 6:07 AM
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At last count those THOUSANDS of stores all over the country were funded with 1.7 billion of our dollars. Wal-mart has about 77 million square feet of empty space across this country either for sale or lease through a real estate holding company they own which is under investigation for questionable practices. The latest effort by Wal mart at winning hearts and minds is their support of the presidents government health care system that will allow them, as the country's largest retail employer to offer health care to all of their minions on our dime. The sales tax revenue from this project is a drop in the bucket as far as income goes, think about it; How are we going to raise SALES tax revenue if no one is BUYING?
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preciousbutterfky
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07-02-09 11:33 PM
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oh yes lets stop expantion and progression in the area. Downtown gloversville is not vacant i hate to tell you. Just go down there. The streets are crawling with scm and white trash with the not so occasional 14 year old mommy in her pajamas walking the streets. And oh yes montgomery county is so clueless that the area is growing at an amazing rate to the point of having to make 30 wider. Looks like they got it figured out rather well to me. No lets stop that from happening in our own county.
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TiredOfTax
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07-02-09 10:44 PM
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The influx of tax would be a boon to Gloversville, now how the money gets used and how the property taxes would be affected is TBD, with the current tenure wasted is the most likely scenario. Stop fooling around and let them build, they have THOUSANDS of stores all over the country, they do not need Timmy and the council clowns that think they know anything slowing this down to the point where the store never opens and we can wallow in another failure. Why would Wal-Mart want a congested highway? Ease of traffic and such factor into the success of the store and succeed is what Wal-Mart does. Back off and just let it happen it will be great. Montgomery counties woes would be MUCH greater without the successful businesses on RTE 30! Or we can sit on our buttocks and wait for more social programs from the big O to help us out of trouble.
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Hilltopper
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07-02-09 10:18 PM
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Monkey County has an almost complete Walart Stupor center, Target, HomeDepot, Lowe's, Tractor Supply, Supermarkets, Drugstores, assorted eateries, etc. all within a mile. The county taxes are not decreasing down there. Keep dreaming, Fulton County.
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TheArchitect
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07-02-09 7:05 PM
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If the fortune 500 Wal-Mart cannot "afford" to meet the meager traffic requirements of the City of Gloversville, Town of Johnstown, and Fulton County, then the environmental review process should be stopped and Wal-Mart can open a Supercenter in a different community Further, there has been no movement toward resolving the non-traffic related environmental consequences associated with the proposed Wal-Mart Supercenter. The problem continues that no one in the employ of the City of Gloversville, Town of Johnstown, or Fulton County has any technical or legal acumen necessary to address the proposed Wal-Mart Supercenter. Our knucklehead leaders keep their heads in the sand, hoping that this urban sprawl will solve the financial distress of the region all while the entire downtown area remains vacant, irregardless of the long-term negative consequences of the proposed development under the guise of economic development. Concious Incompetence.
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xyz123
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07-02-09 7:03 PM
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you folks are very short sighted, we don't need wal*mart. It is not up to the local city hall to fill the empty places. don't be stupid.
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lenstodd
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07-02-09 3:25 PM
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No most likely we will wait until the building is sitting empty, and off the tax roles before we look to fill it. Or someone else will come along and be given extraordinary tax incentives to open something in the empty wai-mart building. They will stay for a couple of years and move on!! Good old Glovesville!!!! Thanks to that wonderful mayor!!
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xsubsquid
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07-02-09 2:02 PM
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Joseph, the current Walmart location is in the Town of Johnstown. It is not up to the city to fill it because it is not in the city currently. Furthermore, the entity known as "the City" is not in the business of establishing businesses. A government exists to either make it more, or less, difficult for individuals, or groups of individuals known as corporations, to establish their own businesses.
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LHReader
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07-02-09 1:57 PM
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Target or Kohls I highly would doubt come to the G'ville area... unfortunately there isn't enough $$ to support it around here. Nevertheless it would be great... just won't happen here. The issue needs to be cleared before Walmart decides to just completely forget about it,or worse ( for Gloversville) place in in the city of Johnstown. It's gone on for way to long now.
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